manufacturing by American hands is out!! traditional trades are out!! machining on US soil is out!! the service, business and/or professional industry is IN!! that is why I am majoring in IT/CIS and not machine technology in J.C.!! machinist jobs have left our shores

Time to dust off my MIS/CIS rant Back in the 90s, there was this perception that Software Engineers and IT people could not communicate. This was started by people who started dot-coms and who knew nothing about computers, and when the started talking to technical people, they were confused. So, they thought, if we could hire people who knew a little about computers, but can communicate, they'd be millionaires. Every lesser college in the country started creating or ramping up their CIS or MIS departments. They'd throw one simple, laughable intro C++ class, some easy math classes, and some easy business classes together and say, viola, you've got the perfect technical/personal hybrid. Every idiot who wanted computer money but didn't understand computers chose that major during the boom. In essence, you got somehow who knew almost nothing of everything. And all these guys started in the boom and graduated in the bust. During the layoffs, these guys were the first to go, if they were hired. When hiring picked up, they realized that all these hardcore software engineers who wanted to move into management could communicate really well, so they hired them for Business Analyst positions, Sales Engineer positions, Managers, etc. - instead of those know nothing CIS majors. My sister in law was an MIS major from the University of Illinois - Chicago. Graduated in 2002. She hardly knows anything about computers (e.g. she didn't know to install anti-virus software). She now works in Mervyns or some place like that. Not many people in her class work in computers. I'm a computer scientist from a top school. We don't take "C++" classes and networking classes. You're suppose to pick it up as you work on tough projects. When I say tough, I mean, "alter an operating system to support virtual memory in one week tough". People like me laugh at CIS majors because not only could they not handle the project even if they were given a year, they probably don't understand the sentence itself.

AMT is exactly right People oughta read this and understand it.

AMT couldn't be more wrong of trade mag and IT job market couldn't be stronger. Even better than his so-ed programmign job. Stop saying that IT is a wannabe career because guess what? That IT grad can get a job as a CEO while you sit as a 'computer scientist' which is a fancy word for 'I don't wanna grow up and play with my toys so I found a company that will let me.' Get a fucking clue will you?

one exception, if you like being stuck in a vehicle and away from home a long time and eating choke-and-puke, truck driving is still a great unionized career opportunity: not for me, no thanks, I want to go home each night in my Lexus and barbecue a t-bone after I leave my air-conditioned cubicle

I am going to a junior college I am majoring in Computer Networking Management: I have no aspiration for computer science (programming and coding): I will be concentrating in LINUX: Linux guys are in a special class : I am thinking I will be a systems or network administrator, some jobs use that term "engineer" I don't know how "engineer" applies to computers whatsoever: I am plug-and-chug pushbutton oriented: in Linux production servers, I gather, one has to be savvy in command line, not GUI's: I will be challenged to master commands Windows guys are a dime a dozen: LINUX is the real future wave in computers!! An engineer is a guy who sticks his head out of a train locomotive: I cannot relate it to IT/CIS whatsoever

Linux has been around for over ten years and it really hasn't made much of a dent on the desktop. Why? You have to tinker with it to get it to work and like the Macs of old, there's little mainstream software that will run on Linux. Linux is fine for servers, it's not really useful on the desktop unless your a Linux geek. I use a Mac that can run Windows if I need Windows apps. I have no reason to even consider Linux!

You realize that MacOS X has a UNIX core right? Linux are very wrong? There are tons of builds of LINUX that don't require any tinkering around with - go to the Linux forum and ask them. This isn't the Mac fanboi forum, this is the job market forum. I know I find more job listings for Linux people than I do Mac people especially in tech fields. What a moron.

Mac and Linux have about the same market share

You're right about the desktop Linux has a LONG way to go before it begins to make inroads on the desktop. Windows is too entrenched, and too many poeple will have to have some, to a great deal, of training to cope. Linux on the back end is making inroads in many areas. I'm on the forefront of movements to to Linux and OPen Source on WallStreet, which is gaining trememendous traction, as people can visualize expensive sun hardware and licensing going away, among numerous othert advantages. I've spearheaded bringing the platform into our development community, and it's become all the rage there. Focus on linux and network communications.

If an end user is given a linux desktop and did it and had access to similar programs it will take them a bit of time to get accustomed to it, but she will. Windows is only popular because the big PC vendors were screwed by Microshaft and that's all.

Are you in the 90s? Linux has GUIs that you look for them. Geez...

But who wants to look for them? Even the easiest Linux installation is out the grasp of your average computer user.

Exactly Linux isn't great for the desktop yet because you have to 'find a gui for it'. I know that Mac OSX and Linux have a related core, but I can just switch on a Mac or PC and use it. I watch my friends fuss with Ubuntu and other builds all the time. I also don't want to have to wade through all the open source crap to find something that works. What the Linux twit above doesn't grasp is that the average computer user just wants to use the easiest tool for the job. They are used to Microsoft and Adobe and have no interest in using anything else. The only way Linux will really work on the desktop is if the major software companies start releasing their software for Linux, until then, forgetaboutit!

You have to find a GUI for Linux? Excuse me? If your friends are fussing with Ubuntu it is because they are geeks and want to fuck with it. You don't have to fuck with it if you don't want to and that's the beauty of it. Since Vista, Microsoft has to either learn that it has to go back to its roots and code something good or Linux will take over. Not some piece of shit MacOS - people don't want to be associated with uberdouches like the poser on the ad...

Not true Plenty of manufacturing done in US. Just not the type taht requires an army of low skill, low paid assembly drones.

what i meant was not many mfg. jobs that pay worth a hoot any more: I am learning Linux because my future IT profession will require it, networking management/systems admin., dealing w/ those production servers, and is highly CLI!! the Internet is LINUX-driven!!